Speaker A: 0:02

Welcome to When She Pivot. I'm Lauren.

Speaker B: 0:04

And I'm Cassie. We're two working moms navigating professional and personal perspective shifts.

Speaker A: 0:09

We're here to hopefully give ourselves and others the permission to think and dream bigger while crafting lives of intention, holding space for all of who we are, professionals, mamas, caregivers, partners, and humans desiring more freedom. With Cassie's experience as a lawyer currently working in the non profit space, and.

Speaker B: 0:26

Lawrence as a former high school teacher turned entrepreneur, we think it's important to normalize this of self exploration with curiosity and openness instead of fear and judgment. Turning down the volume on that critical inner voice and helping you embrace what you actually want.

Speaker A: 0:42

When she Pivots is all about embracing their stories and hearing the stories of women who are maybe just a little bit further ahead on their journeys. Our stories have power not because of where they land us, but because of what we learn along the way.

Speaker B: 0:54

So let's dive in and embrace the messy middle and our stories together.

Speaker A: 0:59

All right. Hello, and welcome back to When She Pivots. So excited for today's episode and to see you beautiful ladies. I actually have a sweet, sweet friend that I have known. I think we've known each other since junior high.

Speaker C: 1:15

I'm pretty sure it's been. It's been that long.

Speaker A: 1:18

Yeah, since we were seventh grade, like eons and eons ago. Yeah. We have my sweet friend Brittany on today, who has had just. I feel like you've lived a thousand lives in terms of business and entrepreneurship and all of the different pivots you've had. And so Cassie and I really wanted to chat with you about all of that today because that's obviously, you know, we're trying to help. The goal is to help other women figure out how to make these pivots or lean into the idea of making a pivot. Should they. Should they be curious about that? And you're an expert on it, so can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what you're doing now, how you got there? Just kind of tell the people who you are.

Speaker C: 2:06

Tell the people who I am. Okay. Seems like a loaded question, but yes. Thrilled. Thrilled to be able to have this conversation today. So who I am. My name's Brittany. I've known you for a long time. Today is my first time meeting Catsy.

Speaker B: 2:22

No, we must have gone to school together too, right?

Speaker C: 2:25

I feel like we did. I just. Yeah, it's one of those things where. Yeah. It's just so many people. Like I said, the world's getting smaller. So who I am. So I run a financial strategy practice where I help people become financially bulletproof, and I stepped into that by sheer accident. So I was managing a woman's gym at the time, and a recruiter reached out to me and asked me if I was interested in joining the financial world. And luckily, my heart was open at the time, and I decided, yeah, like, I'll go ahead and do that. And I. Now I'm just kind of sitting in this position, which is really cool.

Speaker B: 3:07

I mean, was there, like, did you have a prior interest in finance? How did they know to reach out to you? How. How does. How does that even happen?

Speaker C: 3:18

So I have. So my LinkedIn is dialed in, and I kind of had. I have some prior interest in finance in terms of just personally, I had, like, some debt that I wanted to move through, but I never had the tools because I was never really taught those things. I was kind of just always left out of the conversation. My dad always handled stuff, or I always had boyfriends that handled stuff. And before I started this, it was. I don't know if it was just kismet or what was happening, but I was thinking more and more about wanting to make sure that I knew exactly what I was doing. And then I got a call from a recruiter, and I decided to take the call.

Speaker B: 4:05

That's.

Speaker A: 4:05

That's wild.

Speaker C: 4:06

I know.

Speaker B: 4:07

Wildly coincidental. Like, too much coincidence to be a coincidence.

Speaker C: 4:11

Yeah. And that's. And I kind of just go with it. I kind of just go with it. You know, maybe this is just where I'm supposed to be. The journey's been really interesting, though, because, I mean, if you would. If you could guess this at all, which you probably can't. I started in cosmetology.

Speaker A: 4:28

I'm fascinated by your story, the timeline here.

Speaker B: 4:35

And I feel like so many women have these journeys that wind and bend. That's part of being mean, part of being a human, but I think it's actually uniquely part of being a woman, too. And just, like, actions our lives take and what's expected of us and all these different fronts. Before we get to your journey, I have a question that just came up for me, though.

Speaker C: 4:59

Of course.

Speaker B: 5:01

So you talked about having some, like, financial stuff that you wanted to get in order for your own self. And I was kind of curious what. What the messaging was when you were growing up as a young woman around money. Like, what? And how did you. How did you come into this sense of empowerment around it? I think it's rare for women And I'm just curious how you got there.

Speaker C: 5:27

Like, is my mom going to listen to this? You don't want to say my parents aren't going to listen to this. Right. I. The messaging around money was find a husband, find someone to take care of you. So there wasn't a lot of messages around it. It was very. You won't really need to do that. You don't need.

Speaker A: 5:57

That's not going to be your job.

Speaker C: 5:59

No, that's. Your job is to serve your husband. And while I hold some values in terms of being showing up for my partner, I don't think that I was meant to just be serving a husband or a partner of any kind.

Speaker A: 6:20

Literally the opposite of the kind of person that you are.

Speaker C: 6:24

Yes.

Speaker B: 6:25

Yes.

Speaker C: 6:25

If you spend time with me, I. I have a lot to say and that just doesn't go well.

Speaker B: 6:34

We're gonna get along. No.

Speaker C: 6:37

And that's the thing. I have so much respect, Respect for women that choose that role. I'm just really grateful that I have the choice. And that choice for me is to be able to do both if I decide to do so, not like making sure that I have the knowledge. So if I decide to pivot, decide to not work or do those things, I can always have that to fall back on.

Speaker B: 7:01

I just don't. I think there's a lot of messaging. I had my own messaging. That was probably subliminal. You know what I mean? None of it was intentional, I don't think.

Speaker C: 7:11

But parents are just doing the best with what they know. Oh, absolutely.

Speaker B: 7:16

But I also don't think. I think there is a fundamental difference and there's a distinction between being a stay at home mom. There is no shame in that. That is.

Speaker C: 7:26

Oh, that's the hardest job ever.

Speaker B: 7:28

Yeah, I. Yeah. So that's not the thing for me. For me, it's. Even if that is the role that you choose or the role that is right for you and your family for whatever reason, for whatever season. To me, like, I. I wish that I had understood the basics of personal finance to be a meaningful partner in that regard. 1. Because I think it's. I mean, it's cited as one of the most common sources of marital troubles and divorce because it's. It is so fraught. And if you don't have the tools to show up as a partner, you can't chart a life that is built around a shared vision. Integral component of that, in my opinion.

Speaker C: 8:10

Absolutely. Well. And I also think that if women are to choose going into that specific role, I think they need to be empowered to understand the monetary worth of what that is.

Speaker A: 8:25

One million.

Speaker C: 8:26

And to know that they're. They're actually, most of the time what their jobs are doing actually costs more than what their husbands bring in. And to me, I'm like, yes.

Speaker A: 8:42

Yeah, the bells are ringing. Yeah.

Speaker C: 8:45

But most women don't know that. They don't know that. If you calculate what does a nanny cost, what does a private chef cost, if you need to Uber or if you're a personal shuttle, which every mom is. All of these things. House cleaner. Yes, exactly. All of those things. Like if I were to tally up what my house cleaner costs. What.

Speaker A: 9:10

Yeah.

Speaker C: 9:11

Meal prepping. Any of those things.

Speaker B: 9:14

Yeah.

Speaker C: 9:14

All of that usually will total up to more than what a working husband will bring in.

Speaker A: 9:22

Well, I'm always so shocked too. Like, I know Cassie and I both have experience. This is a little bit of a tangent, but I promise it does connect. Both of us have.

Speaker B: 9:33

Right.

Speaker C: 9:34

I mean, this is what we do.

Speaker A: 9:36

Both of us at one point, exclusively pumped. Right. You exclusively pump too, right, Cassie? I think we've talked about that.

Speaker C: 9:44

Yeah.

Speaker B: 9:45

So, yeah. This is a whole other story.

Speaker A: 9:47

I know. But I'm here for it.

Speaker B: 9:49

But I spent seven months exclusively pumping while full time.

Speaker A: 9:54

Yeah. And I was working and exclusively. I. I exclusively exclusive bulla pumped for a year. And I see all these things coming across my feed there. You know, those little quotes that reference their different. Just different things that I'm targeted for. And so many of them talk about the number of hours that go into that in, in the span of six months or a year or whatever. And when you think about things like that that are just a baseline expectation for so many of us, like without.

Speaker C: 10:28

Even a conversation, it's.

Speaker A: 10:31

That's. Yeah. Like, you just don't. There's so many things that go into that list that you're talking about is basically what I'm saying. Like it's not whether you have kids or not. There's all those unspoken. Yeah.

Speaker C: 10:43

It's the mental load as well that doesn't get talked about. And I think about that all the time.

Speaker A: 10:49

Yeah.

Speaker C: 10:50

Like that mental load of, you know, even if you've had a conversation of, okay, house is going to be cleaned, dinner's going to be made, whatever, like Stepford wife, whatever that means to you, the mental load on top of that is another job.

Speaker B: 11:04

Yeah.

Speaker C: 11:04

And if you're at work, in an office, your mental load is compensated. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker B: 11:14

I mean that. This is a whole other conversation too. But I really. It does. The messaging that Women get about their role valued and what's not. Motherhood or not.

Speaker A: 11:24

Yeah.

Speaker B: 11:25

And then motherhood itself as its own thing. Like, all of those things to me are inherently, like, rooted in. They're political, but they're also. There's. There's so much. They're so informed and our views of ourselves, I think, and what we value about ourselves and what our roles are and not is so informed by our. All of the messaging that we're given even as young girls. And so anyways, there is something that is, like, inherently slightly rebellious about a woman in finance. And I particularly given the messaging that you said that you had. So I just find that really, really fierce. I'm such a cool model that you're setting for other women and like the tools to show up as a meaningful partner in that space with confidence to chart a life with a partner or independently such. It's so vital for any pivot a woman's gonna make in her life. And then also I just feel like there's pivots, God willing, that we won't have to navigate. But, like, as a mother of a daughter, like, what messages do I wanna send her? And if something, God forbid, were to happen to my husband. Yeah, I'm the fallback. If I don't know and I'm not dialed in on our finances and how to manage those and how to navigate us through that, who's going to do that? In the event that something happens to.

Speaker C: 12:44

My partner, it gives me goosebumps too, because you hit the nail on the head. And those are the conversations that I have with people all the time. Is both parents, both parties, or even if you're just an individual party, you do need to be informed. You do need to be empowered to know what's going on, because you don't know what's going to happen in the future.

Speaker A: 13:06

Yeah, I think it's the difference between life happening to you and you living your life.

Speaker C: 13:11

Right.

Speaker A: 13:12

Like, I don't know. I think you were talking about how important it is to just have those choices. And the choices are if you have. If you don't have the knowledge behind it, there really aren't choices for you.

Speaker B: 13:25

To make or you just like them.

Speaker A: 13:29

Right.

Speaker B: 13:33

This is like, I just was so.

Speaker C: 13:34

Curious about that right now.

Speaker B: 13:37

I mean, I can share a little bit as we get there or now, but basically, I feel like I. I was sort of not informed, just sort of a bit checked out of being dialed in. And my husband and I made the decision to sell our house, buy a new house. Ended up being a new build. It's almost done. It's been about three years. Um, I'm really excited about it. And if I had understood basic finance, if I had understood the basics, I feel like I would have made more informed choices. And I wish that I hadn't developed this skill set. Really rudimentary. I'm not an expert at all. We're still learning. Let's call a spade a spade.

Speaker C: 14:24

But I think everyone is always in a space of learning, too.

Speaker B: 14:28

Yeah. But that was what pushed me to have to become a partner in that space, a meaningful one. And I just wish that I'd had that skill set before I made that decision, I guess.

Speaker C: 14:40

Did it feel like it was sink or swim for you there?

Speaker B: 14:43

Yeah, it was just a level of pressure that was on us that I didn't. That was not something that I'd understood or contemplated before we'd. Before we took that leap. And by the time I understood the implications of it, um, you know, you were navigating it.

Speaker C: 15:02

Yeah, you were.

Speaker B: 15:03

We're gonna be. We're so fortunate. We're so privileged that we've been able to get through this. There's pieces of it that I'm excited about. It just wasn't an fully informed choice. And so my husband and I have had. Had a lot of, like, really honest conversations, and I feel like this has forced us to come become partners in a way.

Speaker C: 15:26

And I'm really closer after as you are navigating and having these really intimate conversations that don't seem super intimate.

Speaker B: 15:35

Like, I feel like we now are developing the tools to. To develop a shared vision of our lives. You know, that's really rooted in our values in a partnership. And I have a lot of feelings that I'm still unpacking, if I'm being honest about, like, having made a decision not unilaterally. He was there, but I just feel like had we had that tool set beforehand, it would have. Like, we would have been on the same page about the decision, and there wouldn't have been all of these things that went unsaid or all of these aspects of it that, like, we just did not know how to communicate about. But we do now.

Speaker C: 16:21

Yeah.

Speaker B: 16:21

Anyways.

Speaker A: 16:22

Yeah, well. And then when it comes to the pivots.

Speaker C: 16:25

Right.

Speaker A: 16:25

When life changes or when you decide that you might want to explore something different, I can only imagine the differences in those conversations when you've already met that you've set that standard in your relationship or in your marriage for what you guys both want versus if you come to a new space without having had any of those conversations and being like, no, I want to switch it up.

Speaker C: 16:52

That.

Speaker B: 16:52

I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah. I want to get into your story. But the last thing is that I just think that issues like that issues around finance, and I don't know if you find this to be true, Brittany, too, with people that you work with or in your line of work, but I just feel like the issues that we try to avoid because they're uncomfy, they're the ones that will keep coming to a head, and the ante just keeps getting risen until we confront them. Like, it's not.

Speaker C: 17:18

Those are the conversations I have to have or get to have with my clients every day. I get to have tough conversations. And I actually enjoy it because I'm so used to it, though. And it's funny because I can have these conversations that people avoid their whole lives just like they're nothing now. And I wouldn't have been able to do that previously. And now it's kind of cool that that skill set's been kind of ingrained in. And I. I feel like a therapist sometimes.

Speaker A: 17:50

Oh, I bet.

Speaker C: 17:51

Yeah. Because I'll have meetings with couples and talking with them, and sometimes the topic has never been breached with them, and you can see their micro expressions change. And it's just fascinating because as long as I'm safe and I'm comfortable talking about something, most people tend to go, okay, this is okay to talk about. This is safe.

Speaker B: 18:17

How do you set a tone with couples around those difficult conversations? Like, that's a muscle. I imagine you have to flex and, like, get good at.

Speaker C: 18:26

I mean, I can just brief it with, hey, this might be something. This may or may not have been something that you have discussed before, but this is a safe space. Nothing that you or I say will leave this room. And we're just going to talk on some topics that may feel a little uncomfortable. Is that okay with you? And then getting that okay, yes. Or what do you mean? Then we kind of go into it.

Speaker B: 18:55

Interesting.

Speaker C: 18:57

Yeah, it's very. It's. It's a lot like therapy or. Yeah, it's.

Speaker A: 19:01

It's involved.

Speaker C: 19:03

You can speak to that, Lauren. It is very involved.

Speaker A: 19:07

And I can say so I have, as of recently, I have become one of Brittany's clients, so I can share a little bit about my experience there. And I just. I think what's important to be transparent about, and I'm a woman that I have done school, I've had the career, I have the master's like, we've. We're educated women, all three of us. And the insecurity that comes out around money when you didn't grow up, understand, like, again, I super privileged. Didn't have the same worries that so many people have in that, though I also didn't learn how to manage it, how to take care of it, how to. I didn't understand it. And so even as an adult, as a grown woman who's done X, Y and Z, when I had that first meeting with Brittany, and she's somebody that I already know and trust, getting to that point where you're really just laying yourself bare like.

Speaker C: 20:15

Well, it's very vulnerable.

Speaker A: 20:16

Yeah, yeah, it's so vulnerable. Like, this is. This is the reality. This is. I think that's another piece of it, is that when it comes to. At least in my experience, when it comes to finances, the way that we, you know, the per. The perception that we put out is often a little different than maybe what the reality of it is, because it's not something we grew up being. We weren't. We were told not to talk about it. We were. That's not something that you have conversations about. That's not something you bring up. That's not that. Like, we don't talk about it. And so then when all of a sudden you're having to answer questions about the realities of your accounts and your assets and all these things, it's like, oh, man, this is the real of the real right here.

Speaker C: 21:05

Well, it's funny too, because there's always a phrase that my colleagues uses. You can talk about sex, you can talk about drugs, you can talk about rock and roll with your neighbor, but you can't talk about money.

Speaker A: 21:16

It's insane. It's insane.

Speaker B: 21:19

Have you guys. Have either of you? So I follow. I'm getting. I've got. I've gone down a rabbit hole and tried to educate myself. I've read all the books. Like, I mean, I'm. I'm on a journey. I'm also really obsessed with the way that women specifically. I touched on this already, like, the messaging that we get and in the work too. And I've started following this. She's called, like, salary transparent. Have you seen her?

Speaker C: 21:42

No, but I'm writing it down.

Speaker B: 21:44

Oh, my God, she's so cool. We have to link her in the show notes. But she talks about how women are so uncomfortable, men and women. It's not women focused, but particularly women and other marginalized groups, how we are so conditioned not to speak about money that we don't talk about salaries. And so women, it's part of the, the, of the, of sort of the recipe that creates certain people being underpaid for the same.

Speaker A: 22:15

Absolutely.

Speaker B: 22:16

And so anyway, she's created a wildly successful multi six figure business going around and interviewing people, asking what field they work in and asking them to share how much they make.

Speaker A: 22:27

That's incredible.

Speaker B: 22:28

I've got.

Speaker C: 22:29

Those conversations are semi awkward for certain people that are still conditioned to like, let's not talk about that. We can't, but everything else is okay. Which I just, I find insane because this is the one thing we should be talking about with everyone so everyone can have a seat at the table. Yeah.

Speaker A: 22:49

Anyways, I'm looking at her account right now and I'm going to be deep diving about this later. Well, just to kind of shift back to talking a little bit about your career path and the pivot, the many pivots you've made to get to this point. We, something we've talked about in terms of career or job, you know, the thing that you're deciding to do day in and day out. We really learned and spoken with women about how even though we were taught that you're going to grow up and you're going to find one thing, you're going to do that one thing, you're going to do it for the next 60 years and that's all you're ever going to do and that's going to be who you are. Largely, there's this huge shift that's been happening where people are realizing, oh my gosh, I actually can do a multitude of things because I'm a multi passionate person. Maybe it's, maybe I do five things forever or maybe I do one thing followed by the next thing followed by the next thing. I'm just curious, what are your thoughts on learning to leave? We've been talking about societal expectations, you know, like how being a woman, being a woman that's moved through different industries. Just any thoughts or words of wisdom on learning to leave those societal expectations at the door?

Speaker C: 24:12

That is such a good question. Being flexible and knowing what your conditioning is is kind of important, like the ground floor portion of it. Because if we are just going through life on our, like if I just went through life on what I was taught as a little girl, I would not be in the position that I'm in now.

Speaker B: 24:33

Right.

Speaker C: 24:34

I mean, I can give you an example too of how many iterations. Please, how many iterations? Like I said earlier, I started my career as a hairstylist I decided to go to cosmetology school right out of high school because I didn't think that college was important and really just wanted to do what was easy and what I thought was going to be good for me. And I did that for a little while and was like, you know what? I'm an introvert. I learned that I was an introvert by doing hair. That it was really hard for me to interact with tons and tons of people all day long. It's funny because that's what I do now, but it's a little fantasy. I'm right back in that same seat, but I'm just not behind the chair. But that kind of made me decide, okay, maybe I'll go. I'll go and get my undergraduate degree. So I went to UC Davis, studied English rhetoric. So I thought I was like, maybe I want to be an attorney now. So I went through that and did hair all through undergrad and decided to hang up my shears, work in the corporate world. After I got my English degree and kind of just fell upon a sales job and was like, okay, I'll do this for a little bit until I go to lask. Then, you know, things kind of shift and ebb and flow. I, in that sales job, decided that I absolutely hated it. Hated it, hated it. Hated the hours, hated having a boss that wanted me in a chair eight hours a day. It's like, no, okay. I don't know if I want to do this. So while I was in my sales job, I started my first business, my candle business, Emerald Hearth. And that was like, that's still my baby. I was. I've been doing it for five years. It's. It took me nine months to, like, experiment with the recipes before I was ready to, like, bring it out and have. Have her be birthed, so to speak. Right. Yeah, it was.

Speaker B: 26:39

How. How did you come to the. Had you been making candles as a hobby? Like, how did you identify that as the business?

Speaker C: 26:46

I. So I'm a Taurus. I'm very comfort focused. I don't know if we're astrology girlies, but it's one of those things that I. I am also so painfully logical that I looked around my house and I said, what am I spending the most money on? And I looked around, and the most. In that time period, I was spending money hand over fist on candles, and I just was like, oh, I could figure out how to do that. And that's.

Speaker A: 27:18

So you were making decisions about money? Yes, in a different way back then.

Speaker C: 27:22

Yeah. So I was like, what am I, what am I spending the most money on? Other people will probably spend money on that too.

Speaker B: 27:29

That's so brilliant. My head went to that. Like, she's. I don't want to put this on you. This isn't a judgment, but this, like, she's overcompensating for the torturous eight hour corporate job with candles and comforts.

Speaker C: 27:43

Like, I was lighting a candle because it was. It Covid started, you know, and it's lighting a candle. But during that time period, I was spending a lot of money on those things. And it was like, okay. And I have the. I have that delusion where I can figure anything out. And it's true. And I'm going to continue fueling that for myself and everyone. But in this case, it really was true. And so I took about nine months and I started experimenting. I read every book I could get my hands on on how to make candles, and I taught myself how to do it. And then I just kind of brought it into the world. And that was really fun because I was able to. When Covid hit, I was laid off from my job and I already had put in a year of this business that I was building. And so it was like, okay, see ya. Okay, bye. I'll take my severance and go. It was great. And. But that's the interesting part too, is that it didn't really stop there. I love, I loved my business. I still, I have it all set up still. I have my website still. But in. During that time period, I realized, oh, okay, so business is not just about being able to produce a product that's quality. I need to know how to do business. So that's when I decided to go to grad school and thought, okay, I should get an mba. I should do that. I've taken enough time off, I've got my business, I can do this, you know, So I go looking and I find a program that also overlaps with a science of leadership masters. And it was one of those moments where I was like, do I be that person? Do I get two master's degrees? And I decided to do that. I decided that I could do that too. So it was like that, yeah, is that same delusion of like, oh, yeah, I could do that, I'm gonna do it. And so that's what I did. And in the, in that process, I was like, okay, I'm gonna get these master's degrees while I'm running my candle business, and then I'm gonna figure out a different iteration of this business and teach other women how to do business.

Speaker A: 29:55

It.

Speaker C: 29:55

It didn't shift that way. Like, it. It ended up being just, okay, I'm loving this business. I want to use my master's degrees now. So I ended up going and getting a job managing a woman's gym or managing a spa within gym, because, okay, we're still in the same vein spa. I have my cosmetology license. I was able to work with estheticians and massage therapists. It's weird that my cosmetology stuff had carried all the way through after all those years as well. It's like, okay, I guess it is all connected, even though it's wildly different. And in that management role, I loved it. I loved working with women. I loved empowering women, doing, like, the hiring process, interviewing, all those things, bringing in a good team. I got that call from the recruiter during this time. I had just finished those degrees, and I was doing a lot of the financial portions of the business for my boss at the time, and I was really enjoying it. So when I got that call, it was like, yeah, I'll go to the interview.

Speaker A: 31:00

Sure.

Speaker C: 31:00

I'm happy in a job. You know, I've never left a job that I loved before, ever. You know, usually it's kind of like what you're saying, like, we. We get this idea that we need to stick with what we know and what we're doing. And in that moment, it was. It was very clear to me that there were other opportunities that I could reach out and take if I wanted, and then I didn't have to stay put, and it was okay to leave something that I love. And I loved it. I love my coworkers, my boss, she's amazing. She's just awesome female entrepreneur. She. She just. She knows her ****. All the women there, she hires women that know their ****. And it's just I have so many good things to say about her. And it was working for her that helped me see, oh, I can pivot, I can move, you know? And of course, she was disappointed when I was like, hey, so I have this opportunity I'm thinking about. And she was like, you have to do that. You know? So that kind of dropped me into the seat of being in finance after all of those iterations. It was. It's been a wild ride, girls.

Speaker B: 32:11

I think there's so many nuggets. There's so much. So as a person who was very linear. Like, I remember the calculus in college. I was a music vocal performance major slash poly sci Major. I doubled. And I was. I was. I was. And I was like, okay, I don't want to be a music teacher, and I don't want to be a starving artist. Poli Sci. Law school. That sounds right. Like, I. But I needed the next thing, and I needed to know where I was going. And I feel like what's so beautiful about your journey is you're incredibly accomplished. You're insanely well educated. Not that that's important or, like, the only thing to value for other women who are, like, contemplating shifts and pivots. Like, I think. I think you can get your education in a number of different forms.

Speaker C: 33:05

Absolutely.

Speaker B: 33:06

So. But I just think it is wild that you just. You, from the time you were 18, just out of high school, you kind of let yourself flow.

Speaker C: 33:18

And it didn't feel like that. I'll say. I will. I will respond. Respond to that. It did not feel like I have allowed myself to flow until recently. But I. I actually really appreciate you saying that because I need to remind myself of that.

Speaker B: 33:37

I mean, it is. It may have been really uncomfy. It may have not felt. But look. Looking from the outside, just having heard your story as a person who avoided flow at all costs, and I'm just starting to be, like, uncomfortable.

Speaker C: 33:56

I want to know where we're going.

Speaker B: 33:58

I just.

Speaker C: 33:59

Fine.

Speaker B: 33:59

I just find it really beautiful. And like, you and here you are with multiple degrees and coaching women around finance and. And empowering them to step into, like, their power in that space. I just think it's. It's really cool.

Speaker C: 34:15

Thank you.

Speaker B: 34:16

Yeah.

Speaker C: 34:16

It's like I said, it's been a wild ride. And never in a million years, if you were to ask me, while I was behind the chair doing hair, if. If I would have thought that I would be where I am now or even with. With a business of my own, because I'd never. I never really thought about being an entrepreneur. I mean, my upbringing was not that I had. You know, my dad still works, like, a traditional job. He's an engineer. Like, it was all very, like, nuclear family. And this is what you do, and this is the box that you are in. And so once I was able to get out of the box in my own head, you know, that was handed to me in childhood. It was like, oh, well, this life's pretty great. I could do this, you know, Love it.

Speaker A: 35:05

I love it so much. Tell us a little bit about. So you made all of these. You. Yeah. Followed the flow. How, however that happened, uncomfortably or comfortably. Right. But what made, you know, the recruiter reached out. The universe spoke to you and was like, this is where you need to be. Was the decision to work or primarily focus on working with women yours, or was that part of what was proposed to you?

Speaker C: 35:38

That was mine, because you can be. You can be an advisor, and you can. You can work with whoever you want. You can decide. But my decision kind of came from just being scared shitless when I was given this opportunity of, like, I don't know anything about any of this, and knowing that I wanted to bring that ease that I was desperately needing in that moment to other people and knowing, like, as a woman, I should not be this afraid to have these conversations. I should not be so afraid that I'm, like, shaking, you know, getting the.

Speaker A: 36:19

Nervous sweats like I did in my immediate.

Speaker C: 36:22

My back is sweating. I shouldn't. I shouldn't be this nervous, you know, and it. I wanted to be able to bring that sense of ease and calm. And that's funny that I say that. And it's just clicking in, because with Emerald Hearth, with my candle business, it was bringing, like, bringing calm and ease into the home, and now it's tying into bringing a sense of calm and ease into almost like the nervous system. Yeah, yeah. And sharing with other people that, like, you can do this, too. This is not just for people who have the education. It's. All of these resources should be available to everyone. Everyone.

Speaker B: 37:08

I mean, even working at a spa and bringing comfort to people. I feel like there's a consistent thread.

Speaker C: 37:14

There is a very, very tourist road.

Speaker B: 37:20

I. What? I'm part of another nugget that I feel like I've been learning as I hear women's stories, is this idea that, like, people coach and become experts around the things that they most struggled with or where they met their edge. And it's like, in the overcoming that they love this ability to then relate meaningfully to their clients and the people that they work with and also walk them through their path with it. So I feel like the fact that you bumped up against all of that, that you had to work through around finance is what makes you most qualified to work with women, probably in particular around that very thing. Because you've walked it. You've walked that path.

Speaker C: 38:04

Exactly. And that's. That's my passion, too, is just trying to help people have an easier life. Right. Like, we don't have to make it as difficult as we make it on ourselves. I feel like that's kind of an incredibly privileged thing to say, because I know there are many nuances to all of that. But there's a lot of things that we don't have to. It doesn't have to be as hard as we make it. And it can be that simple of, like, the math makes sense. Like, math doesn't lie. There's no emotions to it. Right. And so when you bring math to someone, they bring their emotions. And that's. I think, one of the most challenging parts of what I do now is other people's emotions around their math.

Speaker A: 38:53

Is this why I hate math so much? It's all tied into this.

Speaker C: 38:58

Maybe that's the thing. It doesn't have to be. And we have control over that too. And they're just numbers. They don't. They're not people. They're not. We have our own relationship with the numbers.

Speaker A: 39:09

But I think that's an important thing, too, to note. Is that what you're. The connection you're drawing to wanting especially for women to have access to that information is that at the, you know, at the crux of it, we don't all have that access. If we did, things would look different. But we don't. And so bringing that to the table, I think, is huge. I'm curious, do you have. Obviously, you've experienced all these changes yourself in many ways, for someone. For the woman, I should say, who wants to explore big change. Because those are the women we're really talking to here, and they're the ones that are listening. They either are in the process of making a change, thinking about making a change. Maybe they secretly want to, but they haven't actually spoken it out loud. Um, but want to break into entrepreneurship in some way, you've done it. What kind of words of wisdom could you offer to that woman?

Speaker C: 40:08

Make sure that you have a solid network. Your network is everything. Because if you don't know something, it makes it a lot easier to reach out to your network and just ask. Because when you become an entrepreneur, you know nothing. You think you know, but I. I think that's one of the things that humbled me really quickly, because I'm someone that likes to feel like I know what I'm doing. And in any new arena that I've stepped in, I don't know anything. But I'm like, I'm here. I'm gonna figure it out. But that's only because I've been able to reach out to the people in my network that do know what they're doing and feeling comfortable in that vulnerability of asking. So I think the nugget is have a network get really comfortable being vulnerable and not knowing what you're doing and doing it anyways.

Speaker B: 41:07

Love that. I feel like the older we get, the more competent and established in our careers, the harder that becomes. So I think the more I learn.

Speaker C: 41:14

The less I know.

Speaker A: 41:15

It's so true.

Speaker B: 41:18

Yeah, totally.

Speaker C: 41:20

Yeah.

Speaker B: 41:21

What about. So in addition to that. So we live in a. The three of us live in a high cost of living place. But no matter. Women, like we said before, women have complicated, busy lives. We have lots of responsibilities. Women who are mid career often also have families or caretaking obligations. Like we have real financial obligations in the midst of wanting a shift. And so I guess my question, it doesn't have to get too specific, but I guess. And in addition to that, I think there's so much mindset, so many mindset blocks that we put up around it and the distinguishing between a real obstacle that we need to overcome and like create a plan around versus the roadblocks that we're throwing up because we're scared and we don't even want to look at that. There's a distinction there. And so I, I'm trying to figure out what my question is around that, but I guess it's like, is part of what you could do with someone is help them identify the difference between the two and actually develop a plan or a roadmap if you want to make a pivot, like helping them figure out this is the Runway that you're going to need. And also this is the mindset work and the stuff around unpacking your fear around this as a separate. Is that part of the coaching that you do?

Speaker C: 42:41

So technically not. I mean, I as a human do that with people that I have gotten to know over time with clients that I know already. That's a big part of it. But as a whole, the mindset work is. I would probably defer to a mindset coach, though. I have those tools. I. I don't have the tools to teach them. It's like people think like when parents think that they can teach their kids better than their teacher, they can't. You know, like, just because I know the information doesn't mean that I can impart that to you. Because teaching it to someone is different than adding it to myself. Right? Yeah. I think we're kind of getting into the weeds in terms of like the numeric advice that I would give someone in a meeting if they. Because I can do that. That is something that I can do with someone. I can create a plan. I can show them the numbers of what it means to get them to their goals. Because a lot of what I do is goal. It's goal based, holistic planning. We're looking at the big picture and we're looking at the small steps on how we get to those goals. So sometimes clients have goals to be entrepreneurs. Sometimes they're trying to pay off a home, Sometimes they're. A lot of conversations are planning for retirement. I can help the Runway. Sharing the details is very individual, of.

Speaker B: 44:15

Course, but I would imagine too just offering the clarity in that piece of it and having the knowledge and that feeling of empowerment around it makes it really clear for a person, like what the facts are, what their numbers are versus what they've been telling in their heads.

Speaker C: 44:33

Oh, yeah. And most of the time, the numbers are different than the story. And it's one of those things where I love. I love when I get to come to someone and say, you're doing really, really well. And I can genuinely say, you are crushing it. Look at these numbers. Look at your numbers that you've given me. This is the math that you and I have done together. And this is what your plan looks like.

Speaker A: 45:00

You're.

Speaker C: 45:01

You're doing well. And that's when it. Usually clients will realize that the narrative in their head is different than their actual reality.

Speaker B: 45:14

I would imagine in the opposite scenario too, we just. We're doing our Times book that we read for a little. We're trying to do like a book review that's relevant. Get good with money.

Speaker C: 45:26

Oh, okay.

Speaker B: 45:28

She talks a lot about mindset in that book with those, those and the recommendations that she gives. She kind of weaves in this idea of separating your value, your inherent value as a person from your finances. So if you tell someone they're killing it, that's awesome. But also if they're struggling, it has nothing to do with their value as a person. It's the numbers on a page. And creating that separation is really important for developing this skill set and also being able to address it head on. Because it doesn't say anything about you and your inherent worth.

Speaker C: 45:59

Exactly. It doesn't. Whatever you have in your bank account doesn't make you a better person. It doesn't make you a kind person, doesn't make you full of integrity. It just. It just kind of tells a story of where you've come from and what advantages you've had or how hard you've worked. Sometimes they're not correlated. Right. It just really depends on the person and where they're coming from.

Speaker B: 46:25

I'm obsessed with this I could tell.

Speaker C: 46:26

Yeah.

Speaker A: 46:26

I love it. I love it so much. Gosh. I mean, I've just. I have been so impressed knowing your story and watching you. I was just thinking about the fact that I think we even had an English class together.

Speaker C: 46:43

We did.

Speaker A: 46:44

Okay. I'm not making that up. I was like, I think that.

Speaker C: 46:47

No, we did. I think.

Speaker A: 46:49

Yeah. And so just seeing how this has all, in a twisted way. Right. Come full circle, like, you really do have to just lean into. I don't know if it's the signs you're being given or the places you're feeling pulled to. And it's just really neat to see that you've done that and now you're using that as a tool to help other women. I think it's amazing.

Speaker C: 47:14

I think it's the gut feelings, and we tend. We're taught to ignore those because if you are someone. Because, like, I kind of identified, like, with what you were saying, Cassie. Linear. We are. We do this, then we do this, then we do this, and then we do this, and then this happens, and then you're going to be happy when you've done all of these things. But the reality is, like, none of those things actually make you happy. You have to decide that you're gonna be happy along the way. And it's just learning to listen to that intuition. And I don't know if that's something. I don't know when I learned that, to be honest. Now she's loud and she yells at me.

Speaker B: 47:57

But I, I, I talk a lot when we talk to women. Like, I just, I feel like every woman has their own little superpowers. And it seems like one of yours to me is that you were able to tap into that early and, like, hold on to her in that voice, nurture her early.

Speaker C: 48:15

Yeah.

Speaker B: 48:17

Incredible. And so important because I think so much of the ticking, the boxes and the A plus overachiever mentality is.

Speaker C: 48:27

You don't. Yeah.

Speaker B: 48:30

Like, bobblehead over here and unpack who you're doing it for and whose expectations and whose vision you're working towards. I'm not saying that because I regret my path. And I have felt. I've talked about this before. Like, I've felt periods of my life where I'm in alignment and I'm, like, living in flow or whatever, but I haven't been able to consistently stay connected to that because I think I'm so wedded to a path.

Speaker C: 48:58

Yeah.

Speaker B: 48:59

That it's hard to listen if it's taking me somewhere that I wasn't Expecting to go. So I'm just at this place where I feel like I'm able to start dipping my toe in the water of the thing that you.

Speaker C: 49:09

It's scary.

Speaker B: 49:11

Seem really dialed in on, and I think it's. It's inspiring.

Speaker C: 49:15

It's scary, though. And I think giving yourself credit where credit is due, if you are even aware that you need to tip, dip your toe in, like, that's a huge deal. Like, you're. You're well on your way. It's just making sure that you're gentle with yourself along the way. Because of the conditioning that we have early on, those are the hardest things to break through. We are taught to ignore those voices, ignore that intuition, really. Yeah. I'm trying to remember the book that I. The Untethered Soul.

Speaker A: 49:51

Oh. Oh, my gosh. Isn't that.

Speaker B: 49:54

Yeah.

Speaker A: 49:54

We did an interview with another woman. Literally. Well, we recorded it in real time yesterday, and she mentioned the same one.

Speaker C: 50:04

It. That book really, really changed my perception on the voice in my head. Oh, my God. And who I am. And that. Because that voice in our head, like, we listen to it and it's not actually us. It's just that conditioning that's just replaying. And the things that our brain tells us, we would never tell them to a child or our mother or some. It's insulting. Why do we insult ourselves? You know, body chills right now. Yeah. So if you've not read it, that was a book that really, really changed my perception on how I was moving through.

Speaker B: 50:41

Thank that book in every. So now because it's. Read it, read it, read it.

Speaker C: 50:47

It's really good. I love reading. I love reading all kinds of.

Speaker B: 50:52

I must know. And I know that we're wrapping up to the end, but I need to know now because you've now touched many of the women who. Who kind of stepped into the space of entrepreneurship and been brave enough to just dive. There seems to be a component of self, self growth, self knowledge, and mindset work. And so I was curious. It's. You've been reading books, it sounds like. Is there other work around mindset that you've been doing kind of on your own? What does that look like for you?

Speaker C: 51:22

A lot of that has been reading books. The other component that isn't for everyone is working with a shaman and working with someone who knows more in terms of mindset, in terms of however spiritual or not, that you are working with someone, whether that's a pastor, whether that's a shaman that can help mentor you and guide you on a spiritual path, because I think that that's a huge component in a lot of all of this. Understanding that there is a bigger picture, that we are just kind of, you know, bopping along on a rock that's moving around, so it's not always so serious. And that, that really has helped me, too. But a lot, A lot of books.

Speaker B: 52:18

I love both of those recommendations. I think spiritual growth can look like anything. I think we can define that however we want, and there's so many ways. But I. Yeah, I really appreciate you sharing that as a component of your journey. And we're all Santa Cruz, woo, woo here. I feel like, oh, yeah, yeah, we're very.

Speaker C: 52:37

We're very woo. But yeah, it's. I think there's just a lot of people that. That, that can be forgotten because it's something that you can't touch. It's not tangible, but it's definitely changed who I am and how I view the world. And like, when I have an obstacle, I'm like, you know what? It's not that serious. It's going to be fine. And then I'll pivot and move around it instead of trying to go through it or over it.

Speaker B: 53:01

I love that.

Speaker A: 53:03

That's amazing. Do you have. I. I know I'm putting you on the spot, but are there any other books that come to mind as being, like, key in your journey or in your reflections?

Speaker C: 53:13

So let's see. I'm cheating and I'm looking at my. Oh, that's perfect right now. So I. I just started reading the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. Love that one. I. The Untethered Soul is one of my favorites. I get nuggets from that book every time I reread it. Atomic Habits, I think I've read five times, you know, and I think those are the main ones right now. But I'm always. Oh, and Big Magic was a really good one by Elizabeth Gilbert. I love that one.

Speaker B: 53:53

That is another book that keeps coming up for me. I love her. I haven't read it yet. I think that's.

Speaker C: 53:58

Yeah, there we go. It's time. It's a really, really, really good book. And the Four Agreements as well. That's a really good read. That one really helped me with taking things personally because they really dive into that. Nothing's personal and we just make it personal. That's a whole different.

Speaker B: 54:20

Yeah, we'll have to do another episode about that because I am so down for that conversation.

Speaker C: 54:27

Yeah, we could do. We could do a whole episode on just talking about that. Specific book. It's a really good one that's a more spiritual woo book that I love.

Speaker A: 54:35

Okay, so next book club. There we go.

Speaker C: 54:38

Okay, done. Check, check, check.

Speaker A: 54:41

Brittany, I just adore you and I'm so, so grateful you came on. How can people get in touch with you? How can they work with you? Tell them where they can find you.

Speaker C: 54:52

I will have you guys link my website in the notes. My website is a great way to get a hold of me and my phone number is on there and you can read there. That's the best way.

Speaker A: 55:03

Awesome. Love it. And people can still also find your candles, right? They can.

Speaker C: 55:10

Yes. Yes, you can. Absolutely.

Speaker A: 55:13

Emerald Hearth. Yeah, check that out. They're divine.

Speaker B: 55:16

In corporate life and needing 4 million candles to compensate.

Speaker C: 55:21

Absolutely. I'm thinking I'll come out with some candles for the fall. Just right now I'm really fixated and focused on building my financial practice and the dichotomy of both is great.

Speaker A: 55:33

Yeah, it's always both. All right, well, thank you so much. And to everybody listening, you can do this. You can do it. All right, thanks, ladies. Have a good day tonight.

Speaker B: 55:52

Thanks for listening to When She Pivots. If you enjoyed this episode, we'd love if you'd hit subscribe and leave a review.

Speaker A: 55:58

Find us on Instagram at When she Pivots. And feel free to send us a message with any thoughts, questions, or future episode requests. We'd love to hear from you. Here's to building our truest and most beautiful lives together.